RSD and Fatigue
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continued......
byrd45 Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:59 pm
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> From: <NOBR>byrd45</NOBR> (Original Message) Sent:
>4/25/2006 6:59 PM
>Hi Everyone,
>This week I thought we could discuss the overwhelming fatigue that RSD
>brings into alot of our lives. I have been wondering for awhile why do I
>always feel so tired? Is it the lack of sleep or is it more involved than
>that? I thought we could benenfit from finding out a little bit more about
>this. Today was one of those days. All I could do is sleep and sleep and
>sleep. It is a horrible feeling not a restful sleep but one filled with odd
>dreams and pain bleeding through. Waking up feeling pain only to fall under
>yet again. It feels like you are being drugged or something I hate this
>more than all the insomnia. I have found this usually happens after a
>particularly stressful day. Has this happened to you as well? Anyway most
>weeks I have at least one and occasionally two nights where I cannot sleep
>at all. The other nights I average about 4-6 hours. This is why I have been
>blaming my fatigue on the insomnia, but I wonder if this isn't the entire
>answer. Anyhow, I found this info on the subject on Dr. Hooshmand's site:
>RSD PUZZLE #16
>FATIGUE, WEAKNESS, AND "IDIOPATHIC PARALYSIS"
>
>
>1. Chronic fatigue is a common symptom of RSD only preceded by pain,
>depression, insomnia, and muscle spasms or cramps. The chronic fatigue
>syndrome is a common neurologic condition which is caused by a large list
>of chronic neurologic illnesses such as multiple sclerosis, chronic pain,
>systemic immune diseases, head injuries, and any other systemic or brain
>dysfunction that gets in the way of the normal daily cerebral activity and
>productivity.
>
>2. Weakness is actually an independent symptom of RSD that may or may not
>be accompanied by chronic fatigue. The weakness in the muscles of RSD
>patients is not simply because of fatigue, but it is due to the fact that
>the anterior horn cells and anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord
>are not functioning in coordination and getting in each others way. In RSD,
>the anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord are contributing to the
>secretion of alpha adinergic chemicals causing vasoconstriction, muscle
>spasm, and movement disorder. The movement disorder may be in the form of
>weakness in the extremity, muscle spasm, flexor spasm, tremor, dystonia,
>clumsiness, flexion of the elbow and knee with resultant inability to move
>around smoothly, and difficulty with coordination of rapid or repetitive
>movement of the extremity. The end result is weakness of the extremity.
>
>The long standing disturbance of nerve and muscle function as mentioned
>above also results in gradual disuse atrophy of the extremity with the RSD
>being pushed into stage III with atrophy and weakness of the extremity.
>
>3. "Idiopathic paraplegia". If the RSD is not treated aggressively or
>properly, and specifically if the patient starts using assistive devices
>such as a cane, brace, crutches, and wheelchair, the RSD weakness
>deteriorates rapidly resulting in the patient's inability to even stand up.
>This co-called "idiopathic paralysis" is usually gradual and takes weeks or
>months to develop.
>
>The exceptions in regard to gradual development of idiopathic paralysis is
>the so-called "acute idiopathic paralysis" of RSD. This acute, practically
>sudden onset of paralysis in the lower extremities is the result of two
>forms of treatments.
>
>A. Insertion of spinal stimulators.
>
>B. Insertion of indwelling catheter over the sympathetic chain of ganglia
>in the paraspinal region in the lumbar spine region.
>
>The commonest form of "acute idiopathic paralysis" is seen in patients
>receiving a spinal stimulator. This is seen in around 1/4 of the patients
>receiving spinal stimulator implantation in the spinal canal. If the
>stimulator is inserted in the area of inflammation of RSD, then the foreign
>body effect of the stimulator causes an acute exacerbation and flare-up of
>the muscle weakness and clumsiness as outlined above with resultant
>development of paralysis in the lower extremities. If such a phenomenon
>occurs with the insertion of spinal stimulators in the chronic pain
>patient, one should realize that the condition is a relatively severe RSD,
>and the stimulator should be removed immediately.
>
>The second less common form that we are starting to see with more frequency
>in the past two years, is due to the insertion of the catheters into the
>epidural space, or the area of chain of sympathetic ganglia to prevent
>repeated needling of the patient for sympathetic nerve block. This
>occurrence is far less frequent among the spinal stimulator patients.
>However, when such a paralysis develops, it is essential to remove the
>catheter immediately and not to leave it in overnight. In the patients that
>the catheter is left and is not removed for a few days, the patient even
>develops incontinence of urine and stool.
>
>Examination of such patients shows a sensory loss around the rectal
>(perineal) area which is unique in the form of "onion peeling" unilateral
>sensory loss which is typical of vascular involvement of the spinal cord on
>one side. This is simply explained on the basis of practically all the
>other central nervous system acute complications of RSD due to vascular
>spasm causing disturbance of function.
>
>Unfortunately, such patients are accused of suffering, having "hysterical
>paralysis" without the examiner bothering to check the sensory function
>around the perineal region which is diagnostic and demands the removal of
>the catheter. The sooner the catheter is removed, the less likely the long
>term side effects.
>
>
>
>H. Hooshmand, M.D.
>
>
>Hmm.... he sure did say a mouthful in number two! Described me to a tee.
>Well I guess it comes down to everything combined with our nervous systems
>not funtioning right and the insomnia combined no wonder there is fatigue
>in the picture. What do you think? Does this make sense to you? What are
>your thoughts or experiences with fatigue and RSD. I would love to hear
>them just add them to this post.
> Love,
> Robyn
>
>
> <NOBR>First </NOBR> <NOBR>Previous </NOBR> <NOBR>2-9 of 9 </NOBR>
><NOBR>Next </NOBR> <NOBR>Last </NOBR> <NOBR>Delete Replies </NOBR>
>Reply
> Recommend Delete Message 2 of 9 in Discussion From: Sassy
>Sent: 4/25/2006 8:47 PM 4-6 hours of sleep a night? wow.. must be
>nice... I am lucky to get 2 hours..... This week since last Thursday night,
>I have only gotten a total of 11 hours. Instead of laying in bed awake next
>to my husband and risk waking him up, I get and go to another room, so I
>don't ruin his night sleep. Hope you are feeling better.. Will post more
>tomorrow.. Toodles, Sassy
> Reply
> Recommend Delete Message 3 of 9 in Discussion From: Sassy
>Sent: 4/26/2006 7:24 AM No sleep again last night.... Have to meet with
>the attorney in about an hour. I need to get dressed. I am scheduled for
>another block tomorrow. I am so happy when I have those. It means I
>actually sleep for a day from all of the sedation. Isn't that sad? My
>mother caused issues over the weekend and I am officially changing my phone
>number this week so she can only communicate with me via email.. Let's see
>how she likes that.... The cold hearted witch has tried to drive a wedge
>between my husband and I and in return it has backfired on her... I guess
>she should be careful what she wishes for.. By the way, do you have a new
>member from Fl who hasn't posted yet? Just curious, because my mom said
>something to me on the phone over the weekend that she only would have
>known from one of two support groups I joined.... So, I think she is
>spying.. So like her....... I will post again by Next Monday..... I wish
>everyone Low Low Pain days....... It is supposed to be 93 here today so I
>can't wait to do my pool exercises... Toodles, Sassy
> Reply
> Recommend Delete Message 4 of 9 in Discussion From:
><NOBR>byrd45</NOBR> Sent: 4/26/2006 10:36 AM Hi Sassy, I was the same
>way as you for the first two years of having RSD. No sleep or maybe an hour
>or hour and a half a night. That is when they put me on elavil before
>bedtime so thankful they did! Without it I can't sleep at all. At least
>with it I stay asleep for the 4-6 hours. Maybe you can ask your doc about
>something to help you sleep? Just a thought. I know how horrible it feels
>to be sleep deprived like that. I can't believe your mom is being that mean
>how horrible! I would change my number too. That is so sad that she can't
>be supportive instead of cruel. I don't always know where members are from
>unless they want to share that info, however I will keep my eyes open for
>you. If she even tried anything funny (posting)I would delete it and her to
>protect my members including you of course so don't you worry. I'm glad you
>and your husband realized what she was up to and hopefully everything is
>okay between you both. Have fun in the pool!
> Love,
> Robyn
>
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Reply
Recommend Delete Message 4 of 4 in Discussion
From: byrd45 Sent: 5/1/2006 6:45 PM
Hi Vallerie,
It is great to hear from you! I know what you mean about the elavil I don't know what I would do without it. How is the morphine pump working out for you? Is it helping with the pain levels some? I hope it is and hope to talk to you again real soon!
Love,
Robyn
> Recommend
>
> Message 1 in Discussion
>
>
>
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>
>
> From:
> byrd45
>
>
>
>
> From: <NOBR>byrd45</NOBR> (Original Message) Sent:
>4/25/2006 6:59 PM
>Hi Everyone,
>This week I thought we could discuss the overwhelming fatigue that RSD
>brings into alot of our lives. I have been wondering for awhile why do I
>always feel so tired? Is it the lack of sleep or is it more involved than
>that? I thought we could benenfit from finding out a little bit more about
>this. Today was one of those days. All I could do is sleep and sleep and
>sleep. It is a horrible feeling not a restful sleep but one filled with odd
>dreams and pain bleeding through. Waking up feeling pain only to fall under
>yet again. It feels like you are being drugged or something I hate this
>more than all the insomnia. I have found this usually happens after a
>particularly stressful day. Has this happened to you as well? Anyway most
>weeks I have at least one and occasionally two nights where I cannot sleep
>at all. The other nights I average about 4-6 hours. This is why I have been
>blaming my fatigue on the insomnia, but I wonder if this isn't the entire
>answer. Anyhow, I found this info on the subject on Dr. Hooshmand's site:
>RSD PUZZLE #16
>FATIGUE, WEAKNESS, AND "IDIOPATHIC PARALYSIS"
>
>
>1. Chronic fatigue is a common symptom of RSD only preceded by pain,
>depression, insomnia, and muscle spasms or cramps. The chronic fatigue
>syndrome is a common neurologic condition which is caused by a large list
>of chronic neurologic illnesses such as multiple sclerosis, chronic pain,
>systemic immune diseases, head injuries, and any other systemic or brain
>dysfunction that gets in the way of the normal daily cerebral activity and
>productivity.
>
>2. Weakness is actually an independent symptom of RSD that may or may not
>be accompanied by chronic fatigue. The weakness in the muscles of RSD
>patients is not simply because of fatigue, but it is due to the fact that
>the anterior horn cells and anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord
>are not functioning in coordination and getting in each others way. In RSD,
>the anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord are contributing to the
>secretion of alpha adinergic chemicals causing vasoconstriction, muscle
>spasm, and movement disorder. The movement disorder may be in the form of
>weakness in the extremity, muscle spasm, flexor spasm, tremor, dystonia,
>clumsiness, flexion of the elbow and knee with resultant inability to move
>around smoothly, and difficulty with coordination of rapid or repetitive
>movement of the extremity. The end result is weakness of the extremity.
>
>The long standing disturbance of nerve and muscle function as mentioned
>above also results in gradual disuse atrophy of the extremity with the RSD
>being pushed into stage III with atrophy and weakness of the extremity.
>
>3. "Idiopathic paraplegia". If the RSD is not treated aggressively or
>properly, and specifically if the patient starts using assistive devices
>such as a cane, brace, crutches, and wheelchair, the RSD weakness
>deteriorates rapidly resulting in the patient's inability to even stand up.
>This co-called "idiopathic paralysis" is usually gradual and takes weeks or
>months to develop.
>
>The exceptions in regard to gradual development of idiopathic paralysis is
>the so-called "acute idiopathic paralysis" of RSD. This acute, practically
>sudden onset of paralysis in the lower extremities is the result of two
>forms of treatments.
>
>A. Insertion of spinal stimulators.
>
>B. Insertion of indwelling catheter over the sympathetic chain of ganglia
>in the paraspinal region in the lumbar spine region.
>
>The commonest form of "acute idiopathic paralysis" is seen in patients
>receiving a spinal stimulator. This is seen in around 1/4 of the patients
>receiving spinal stimulator implantation in the spinal canal. If the
>stimulator is inserted in the area of inflammation of RSD, then the foreign
>body effect of the stimulator causes an acute exacerbation and flare-up of
>the muscle weakness and clumsiness as outlined above with resultant
>development of paralysis in the lower extremities. If such a phenomenon
>occurs with the insertion of spinal stimulators in the chronic pain
>patient, one should realize that the condition is a relatively severe RSD,
>and the stimulator should be removed immediately.
>
>The second less common form that we are starting to see with more frequency
>in the past two years, is due to the insertion of the catheters into the
>epidural space, or the area of chain of sympathetic ganglia to prevent
>repeated needling of the patient for sympathetic nerve block. This
>occurrence is far less frequent among the spinal stimulator patients.
>However, when such a paralysis develops, it is essential to remove the
>catheter immediately and not to leave it in overnight. In the patients that
>the catheter is left and is not removed for a few days, the patient even
>develops incontinence of urine and stool.
>
>Examination of such patients shows a sensory loss around the rectal
>(perineal) area which is unique in the form of "onion peeling" unilateral
>sensory loss which is typical of vascular involvement of the spinal cord on
>one side. This is simply explained on the basis of practically all the
>other central nervous system acute complications of RSD due to vascular
>spasm causing disturbance of function.
>
>Unfortunately, such patients are accused of suffering, having "hysterical
>paralysis" without the examiner bothering to check the sensory function
>around the perineal region which is diagnostic and demands the removal of
>the catheter. The sooner the catheter is removed, the less likely the long
>term side effects.
>
>
>
>H. Hooshmand, M.D.
>
>
>Hmm.... he sure did say a mouthful in number two! Described me to a tee.
>Well I guess it comes down to everything combined with our nervous systems
>not funtioning right and the insomnia combined no wonder there is fatigue
>in the picture. What do you think? Does this make sense to you? What are
>your thoughts or experiences with fatigue and RSD. I would love to hear
>them just add them to this post.
> Love,
> Robyn
>
>
> <NOBR>First </NOBR> <NOBR>Previous </NOBR> <NOBR>2-9 of 9 </NOBR>
><NOBR>Next </NOBR> <NOBR>Last </NOBR> <NOBR>Delete Replies </NOBR>
>Reply
> Recommend Delete Message 2 of 9 in Discussion From: Sassy
>Sent: 4/25/2006 8:47 PM 4-6 hours of sleep a night? wow.. must be
>nice... I am lucky to get 2 hours..... This week since last Thursday night,
>I have only gotten a total of 11 hours. Instead of laying in bed awake next
>to my husband and risk waking him up, I get and go to another room, so I
>don't ruin his night sleep. Hope you are feeling better.. Will post more
>tomorrow.. Toodles, Sassy
> Reply
> Recommend Delete Message 3 of 9 in Discussion From: Sassy
>Sent: 4/26/2006 7:24 AM No sleep again last night.... Have to meet with
>the attorney in about an hour. I need to get dressed. I am scheduled for
>another block tomorrow. I am so happy when I have those. It means I
>actually sleep for a day from all of the sedation. Isn't that sad? My
>mother caused issues over the weekend and I am officially changing my phone
>number this week so she can only communicate with me via email.. Let's see
>how she likes that.... The cold hearted witch has tried to drive a wedge
>between my husband and I and in return it has backfired on her... I guess
>she should be careful what she wishes for.. By the way, do you have a new
>member from Fl who hasn't posted yet? Just curious, because my mom said
>something to me on the phone over the weekend that she only would have
>known from one of two support groups I joined.... So, I think she is
>spying.. So like her....... I will post again by Next Monday..... I wish
>everyone Low Low Pain days....... It is supposed to be 93 here today so I
>can't wait to do my pool exercises... Toodles, Sassy
> Reply
> Recommend Delete Message 4 of 9 in Discussion From:
><NOBR>byrd45</NOBR> Sent: 4/26/2006 10:36 AM Hi Sassy, I was the same
>way as you for the first two years of having RSD. No sleep or maybe an hour
>or hour and a half a night. That is when they put me on elavil before
>bedtime so thankful they did! Without it I can't sleep at all. At least
>with it I stay asleep for the 4-6 hours. Maybe you can ask your doc about
>something to help you sleep? Just a thought. I know how horrible it feels
>to be sleep deprived like that. I can't believe your mom is being that mean
>how horrible! I would change my number too. That is so sad that she can't
>be supportive instead of cruel. I don't always know where members are from
>unless they want to share that info, however I will keep my eyes open for
>you. If she even tried anything funny (posting)I would delete it and her to
>protect my members including you of course so don't you worry. I'm glad you
>and your husband realized what she was up to and hopefully everything is
>okay between you both. Have fun in the pool!
> Love,
> Robyn
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> View other groups in this category.
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>Start Chatting | Listen to Music | House & Home | Try Online Dating | Daily
>Horoscopes
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Reply
Recommend Delete Message 4 of 4 in Discussion
From: byrd45 Sent: 5/1/2006 6:45 PM
Hi Vallerie,
It is great to hear from you! I know what you mean about the elavil I don't know what I would do without it. How is the morphine pump working out for you? Is it helping with the pain levels some? I hope it is and hope to talk to you again real soon!
Love,
Robyn
byrd45- Admin
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continued.......
byrd45 Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:59 pm
>From: "byrd45" <EARLIBYRD@msn.com>
>Reply-To: "RSD Outreach" <RSDOutreach@groups.msn.com>
>To: "RSD Outreach" <RSDOutreach@groups.msn.com>
>Subject: RSD and Fatigue
>Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2006 16:00:19 -0700
>
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> New Message on RSD Outreach
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> RSD and Fatigue
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> Reply
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> Reply to Sender
> Recommend
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> Message 1 in Discussion
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>
> From:
> byrd45
>
>
>
>
>
>Hi Everyone,
>This week I thought we could discuss the overwhelming fatigue that RSD
>brings into alot of our lives. I have been wondering for awhile why do I
>always feel so tired? Is it the lack of sleep or is it more involved than
>that? I thought we could benenfit from finding out a little bit more about
>this. Today was one of those days. All I could do is sleep and sleep and
>sleep. It is a horrible feeling not a restful sleep but one filled with odd
>dreams and pain bleeding through. Waking up feeling pain only to fall under
>yet again. It feels like you are being drugged or something I hate this
>more than all the insomnia. I have found this usually happens after a
>particularly stressful day. Has this happened to you as well? Anyway most
>weeks I have at least one and occasionally two nights where I cannot sleep
>at all. The other nights I average about 4-6 hours. This is why I have been
>blaming my fatigue on the insomnia, but I wonder if this isn't the entire
>answer. Anyhow, I found this info on the subject on Dr. Hooshmand's site:
>RSD PUZZLE #16
>FATIGUE, WEAKNESS, AND "IDIOPATHIC PARALYSIS"
>
>
>1. Chronic fatigue is a common symptom of RSD only preceded by pain,
>depression, insomnia, and muscle spasms or cramps. The chronic fatigue
>syndrome is a common neurologic condition which is caused by a large list
>of chronic neurologic illnesses such as multiple sclerosis, chronic pain,
>systemic immune diseases, head injuries, and any other systemic or brain
>dysfunction that gets in the way of the normal daily cerebral activity and
>productivity.
>
>2. Weakness is actually an independent symptom of RSD that may or may not
>be accompanied by chronic fatigue. The weakness in the muscles of RSD
>patients is not simply because of fatigue, but it is due to the fact that
>the anterior horn cells and anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord
>are not functioning in coordination and getting in each others way. In RSD,
>the anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord are contributing to the
>secretion of alpha adinergic chemicals causing vasoconstriction, muscle
>spasm, and movement disorder. The movement disorder may be in the form of
>weakness in the extremity, muscle spasm, flexor spasm, tremor, dystonia,
>clumsiness, flexion of the elbow and knee with resultant inability to move
>around smoothly, and difficulty with coordination of rapid or repetitive
>movement of the extremity. The end result is weakness of the extremity.
>
>The long standing disturbance of nerve and muscle function as mentioned
>above also results in gradual disuse atrophy of the extremity with the RSD
>being pushed into stage III with atrophy and weakness of the extremity.
>
>3. "Idiopathic paraplegia". If the RSD is not treated aggressively or
>properly, and specifically if the patient starts using assistive devices
>such as a cane, brace, crutches, and wheelchair, the RSD weakness
>deteriorates rapidly resulting in the patient's inability to even stand up.
>This co-called "idiopathic paralysis" is usually gradual and takes weeks or
>months to develop.
>
>The exceptions in regard to gradual development of idiopathic paralysis is
>the so-called "acute idiopathic paralysis" of RSD. This acute, practically
>sudden onset of paralysis in the lower extremities is the result of two
>forms of treatments.
>
>A. Insertion of spinal stimulators.
>
>B. Insertion of indwelling catheter over the sympathetic chain of ganglia
>in the paraspinal region in the lumbar spine region.
>
>The commonest form of "acute idiopathic paralysis" is seen in patients
>receiving a spinal stimulator. This is seen in around 1/4 of the patients
>receiving spinal stimulator implantation in the spinal canal. If the
>stimulator is inserted in the area of inflammation of RSD, then the foreign
>body effect of the stimulator causes an acute exacerbation and flare-up of
>the muscle weakness and clumsiness as outlined above with resultant
>development of paralysis in the lower extremities. If such a phenomenon
>occurs with the insertion of spinal stimulators in the chronic pain
>patient, one should realize that the condition is a relatively severe RSD,
>and the stimulator should be removed immediately.
>
>The second less common form that we are starting to see with more frequency
>in the past two years, is due to the insertion of the catheters into the
>epidural space, or the area of chain of sympathetic ganglia to prevent
>repeated needling of the patient for sympathetic nerve block. This
>occurrence is far less frequent among the spinal stimulator patients.
>However, when such a paralysis develops, it is essential to remove the
>catheter immediately and not to leave it in overnight. In the patients that
>the catheter is left and is not removed for a few days, the patient even
>develops incontinence of urine and stool.
>
>Examination of such patients shows a sensory loss around the rectal
>(perineal) area which is unique in the form of "onion peeling" unilateral
>sensory loss which is typical of vascular involvement of the spinal cord on
>one side. This is simply explained on the basis of practically all the
>other central nervous system acute complications of RSD due to vascular
>spasm causing disturbance of function.
>
>Unfortunately, such patients are accused of suffering, having "hysterical
>paralysis" without the examiner bothering to check the sensory function
>around the perineal region which is diagnostic and demands the removal of
>the catheter. The sooner the catheter is removed, the less likely the long
>term side effects.
>
>
>
>H. Hooshmand, M.D.
>
>
>Hmm.... he sure did say a mouthful in number two! Described me to a tee.
>Well I guess it comes down to everything combined with our nervous systems
>not funtioning right and the insomnia combined no wonder there is fatigue
>in the picture. What do you think? Does this make sense to you? What are
>your thoughts or experiences with fatigue and RSD. I would love to hear
>them just add them to this post.
> Love,
> Robyn
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> View other groups in this category.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Also on MSN:
>Start Chatting | Listen to Music | House & Home | Try Online Dating | Daily
>Horoscopes
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Reply
Recommend Delete Message 9 of 9 in Discussion
From: <NOBR>byrd45</NOBR> Sent: 4/28/2006 12:45 PM
Hi Everybody,
I was wondering if it was just me too for a while until I asked my doctor and she assured me the RSD was the culprit. I am sorry others are dealing with this too, but glad that we are able to compare notes on it. It is true that alot of doctor's are still grasping at straws out there, so it really does help to talk about it with each other.
Hi Sassy, he is so sweet you can really tell how much he loves you. I hope you were able to get that nap. Take them whenever you can at least that way you are getting some sleep.
Hi Eileen, I'm not happy you are dealing with this too, but am glad the discussion helped you out. I do get mood swings too but they were really horrible when I was taking Neurontin! Now they come still but not as severely as then. It is a terrible feeling just like a dead battery. I always keep you and everyone here in my prayers so not a problem
Hi Maybel,I know what you mean about the swelling I get that too. Have you noticed when your RSD is flaring like that that under your eyes tends to swell too or it can look reddish also? Look and see next time it's a symptom that the RSD is flaring or acting up. With me my lips and face swell too but I'm not sure if that is because of my RSD being in the face as well it could be because of that.Cooking always takes a whole lot out of me too! Yesterday I made spaghetti and meatballs and I make my own sauce so it takes awhile plus I fry the meatballs before they go in the sauce. I exhausted myself so bad I could barely put the leftovers away and then collapsed. I was done! No choice... I left all the dishes and they would have had to sit until this morning(which I hate to do) but I just could not move one more inch. Hubby did them(I was so thankful)instead.
Hi Trudy,
I found paragraph two made a whole lot of sense to me too. Did you go for the sleep testing yet? My mother-in-law has sleep apnea they have you go to a sleep center overnight and hook you up to machines to monitor your respiration while you sleep. Let me know how that turns out for you. I know what you mean about feeling so tired it is hard to stand through a shower. I have the same problems on alot of days. I have learned to shower fast and I have a bar in the shower I can hold onto just in case my balance becomes a problem. Luckily it is part of my shower wall so that helps me alot. I understand about the typing being hard just post as you are able too and we will miss you in between but we all understand.
Talk to you all soon!
Love,
Robyn
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 3 of 4 in Discussion
From: Katiedid2256 Sent: 5/1/2006 12:32 PM
robin,i to know about not sleeping,iam lucky to sleep 2/3 hours a
night,stress is a big part,i also take evail 2 times anight or i wouldnt get
that sleep .i have the weekness and fell tired all the time i have been like
this for three years now i take enough meds,have morphine pump enplanted you
would think i would sleep all the time not the case.i have been ofline for a
while now and hope to get back talking to everyone.thanks vallerie
>From: "byrd45" <EARLIBYRD@msn.com>
>Reply-To: "RSD Outreach" <RSDOutreach@groups.msn.com>
>To: "RSD Outreach" <RSDOutreach@groups.msn.com>
>Subject: RSD & Fatigue
>Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 08:19:12 -0700
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> RSD & Fatigue
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>Reply-To: "RSD Outreach" <RSDOutreach@groups.msn.com>
>To: "RSD Outreach" <RSDOutreach@groups.msn.com>
>Subject: RSD and Fatigue
>Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2006 16:00:19 -0700
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> byrd45
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>Hi Everyone,
>This week I thought we could discuss the overwhelming fatigue that RSD
>brings into alot of our lives. I have been wondering for awhile why do I
>always feel so tired? Is it the lack of sleep or is it more involved than
>that? I thought we could benenfit from finding out a little bit more about
>this. Today was one of those days. All I could do is sleep and sleep and
>sleep. It is a horrible feeling not a restful sleep but one filled with odd
>dreams and pain bleeding through. Waking up feeling pain only to fall under
>yet again. It feels like you are being drugged or something I hate this
>more than all the insomnia. I have found this usually happens after a
>particularly stressful day. Has this happened to you as well? Anyway most
>weeks I have at least one and occasionally two nights where I cannot sleep
>at all. The other nights I average about 4-6 hours. This is why I have been
>blaming my fatigue on the insomnia, but I wonder if this isn't the entire
>answer. Anyhow, I found this info on the subject on Dr. Hooshmand's site:
>RSD PUZZLE #16
>FATIGUE, WEAKNESS, AND "IDIOPATHIC PARALYSIS"
>
>
>1. Chronic fatigue is a common symptom of RSD only preceded by pain,
>depression, insomnia, and muscle spasms or cramps. The chronic fatigue
>syndrome is a common neurologic condition which is caused by a large list
>of chronic neurologic illnesses such as multiple sclerosis, chronic pain,
>systemic immune diseases, head injuries, and any other systemic or brain
>dysfunction that gets in the way of the normal daily cerebral activity and
>productivity.
>
>2. Weakness is actually an independent symptom of RSD that may or may not
>be accompanied by chronic fatigue. The weakness in the muscles of RSD
>patients is not simply because of fatigue, but it is due to the fact that
>the anterior horn cells and anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord
>are not functioning in coordination and getting in each others way. In RSD,
>the anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord are contributing to the
>secretion of alpha adinergic chemicals causing vasoconstriction, muscle
>spasm, and movement disorder. The movement disorder may be in the form of
>weakness in the extremity, muscle spasm, flexor spasm, tremor, dystonia,
>clumsiness, flexion of the elbow and knee with resultant inability to move
>around smoothly, and difficulty with coordination of rapid or repetitive
>movement of the extremity. The end result is weakness of the extremity.
>
>The long standing disturbance of nerve and muscle function as mentioned
>above also results in gradual disuse atrophy of the extremity with the RSD
>being pushed into stage III with atrophy and weakness of the extremity.
>
>3. "Idiopathic paraplegia". If the RSD is not treated aggressively or
>properly, and specifically if the patient starts using assistive devices
>such as a cane, brace, crutches, and wheelchair, the RSD weakness
>deteriorates rapidly resulting in the patient's inability to even stand up.
>This co-called "idiopathic paralysis" is usually gradual and takes weeks or
>months to develop.
>
>The exceptions in regard to gradual development of idiopathic paralysis is
>the so-called "acute idiopathic paralysis" of RSD. This acute, practically
>sudden onset of paralysis in the lower extremities is the result of two
>forms of treatments.
>
>A. Insertion of spinal stimulators.
>
>B. Insertion of indwelling catheter over the sympathetic chain of ganglia
>in the paraspinal region in the lumbar spine region.
>
>The commonest form of "acute idiopathic paralysis" is seen in patients
>receiving a spinal stimulator. This is seen in around 1/4 of the patients
>receiving spinal stimulator implantation in the spinal canal. If the
>stimulator is inserted in the area of inflammation of RSD, then the foreign
>body effect of the stimulator causes an acute exacerbation and flare-up of
>the muscle weakness and clumsiness as outlined above with resultant
>development of paralysis in the lower extremities. If such a phenomenon
>occurs with the insertion of spinal stimulators in the chronic pain
>patient, one should realize that the condition is a relatively severe RSD,
>and the stimulator should be removed immediately.
>
>The second less common form that we are starting to see with more frequency
>in the past two years, is due to the insertion of the catheters into the
>epidural space, or the area of chain of sympathetic ganglia to prevent
>repeated needling of the patient for sympathetic nerve block. This
>occurrence is far less frequent among the spinal stimulator patients.
>However, when such a paralysis develops, it is essential to remove the
>catheter immediately and not to leave it in overnight. In the patients that
>the catheter is left and is not removed for a few days, the patient even
>develops incontinence of urine and stool.
>
>Examination of such patients shows a sensory loss around the rectal
>(perineal) area which is unique in the form of "onion peeling" unilateral
>sensory loss which is typical of vascular involvement of the spinal cord on
>one side. This is simply explained on the basis of practically all the
>other central nervous system acute complications of RSD due to vascular
>spasm causing disturbance of function.
>
>Unfortunately, such patients are accused of suffering, having "hysterical
>paralysis" without the examiner bothering to check the sensory function
>around the perineal region which is diagnostic and demands the removal of
>the catheter. The sooner the catheter is removed, the less likely the long
>term side effects.
>
>
>
>H. Hooshmand, M.D.
>
>
>Hmm.... he sure did say a mouthful in number two! Described me to a tee.
>Well I guess it comes down to everything combined with our nervous systems
>not funtioning right and the insomnia combined no wonder there is fatigue
>in the picture. What do you think? Does this make sense to you? What are
>your thoughts or experiences with fatigue and RSD. I would love to hear
>them just add them to this post.
> Love,
> Robyn
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Reply
Recommend Delete Message 9 of 9 in Discussion
From: <NOBR>byrd45</NOBR> Sent: 4/28/2006 12:45 PM
Hi Everybody,
I was wondering if it was just me too for a while until I asked my doctor and she assured me the RSD was the culprit. I am sorry others are dealing with this too, but glad that we are able to compare notes on it. It is true that alot of doctor's are still grasping at straws out there, so it really does help to talk about it with each other.
Hi Sassy, he is so sweet you can really tell how much he loves you. I hope you were able to get that nap. Take them whenever you can at least that way you are getting some sleep.
Hi Eileen, I'm not happy you are dealing with this too, but am glad the discussion helped you out. I do get mood swings too but they were really horrible when I was taking Neurontin! Now they come still but not as severely as then. It is a terrible feeling just like a dead battery. I always keep you and everyone here in my prayers so not a problem
Hi Maybel,I know what you mean about the swelling I get that too. Have you noticed when your RSD is flaring like that that under your eyes tends to swell too or it can look reddish also? Look and see next time it's a symptom that the RSD is flaring or acting up. With me my lips and face swell too but I'm not sure if that is because of my RSD being in the face as well it could be because of that.Cooking always takes a whole lot out of me too! Yesterday I made spaghetti and meatballs and I make my own sauce so it takes awhile plus I fry the meatballs before they go in the sauce. I exhausted myself so bad I could barely put the leftovers away and then collapsed. I was done! No choice... I left all the dishes and they would have had to sit until this morning(which I hate to do) but I just could not move one more inch. Hubby did them(I was so thankful)instead.
Hi Trudy,
I found paragraph two made a whole lot of sense to me too. Did you go for the sleep testing yet? My mother-in-law has sleep apnea they have you go to a sleep center overnight and hook you up to machines to monitor your respiration while you sleep. Let me know how that turns out for you. I know what you mean about feeling so tired it is hard to stand through a shower. I have the same problems on alot of days. I have learned to shower fast and I have a bar in the shower I can hold onto just in case my balance becomes a problem. Luckily it is part of my shower wall so that helps me alot. I understand about the typing being hard just post as you are able too and we will miss you in between but we all understand.
Talk to you all soon!
Love,
Robyn
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 3 of 4 in Discussion
From: Katiedid2256 Sent: 5/1/2006 12:32 PM
robin,i to know about not sleeping,iam lucky to sleep 2/3 hours a
night,stress is a big part,i also take evail 2 times anight or i wouldnt get
that sleep .i have the weekness and fell tired all the time i have been like
this for three years now i take enough meds,have morphine pump enplanted you
would think i would sleep all the time not the case.i have been ofline for a
while now and hope to get back talking to everyone.thanks vallerie
>From: "byrd45" <EARLIBYRD@msn.com>
>Reply-To: "RSD Outreach" <RSDOutreach@groups.msn.com>
>To: "RSD Outreach" <RSDOutreach@groups.msn.com>
>Subject: RSD & Fatigue
>Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 08:19:12 -0700
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
> New Message on RSD Outreach
>
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> RSD & Fatigue
>
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> Reply
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byrd45- Admin
- Posts : 1014
Points : 343
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2008-10-29
Age : 60
Location : PA -
RSD and Fatigue
byrd45 Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:54 pm
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 1 of 4 in Discussion
From: byrd45 (Original Message) Sent: 5/1/2006 11:19 AM
From: <NOBR>byrd45</NOBR> (Original Message) Sent: 4/25/2006 6:59 PM
Hi Everyone,
This week I thought we could discuss the overwhelming fatigue that RSD brings into alot of our lives. I have been wondering for awhile why do I always feel so tired? Is it the lack of sleep or is it more involved than that? I thought we could benenfit from finding out a little bit more about this. Today was one of those days. All I could do is sleep and sleep and sleep. It is a horrible feeling not a restful sleep but one filled with odd dreams and pain bleeding through. Waking up feeling pain only to fall under yet again. It feels like you are being drugged or something I hate this more than all the insomnia. I have found this usually happens after a particularly stressful day. Has this happened to you as well? Anyway most weeks I have at least one and occasionally two nights where I cannot sleep at all. The other nights I average about 4-6 hours. This is why I have been blaming my fatigue on the insomnia, but I wonder if this isn't the entire answer. Anyhow, I found this info on the subject on Dr. Hooshmand's site:
RSD PUZZLE #16
FATIGUE, WEAKNESS, AND "IDIOPATHIC PARALYSIS"
1. Chronic fatigue is a common symptom of RSD only preceded by pain, depression, insomnia, and muscle spasms or cramps. The chronic fatigue syndrome is a common neurologic condition which is caused by a large list of chronic neurologic illnesses such as multiple sclerosis, chronic pain, systemic immune diseases, head injuries, and any other systemic or brain dysfunction that gets in the way of the normal daily cerebral activity and productivity.
2. Weakness is actually an independent symptom of RSD that may or may not be accompanied by chronic fatigue. The weakness in the muscles of RSD patients is not simply because of fatigue, but it is due to the fact that the anterior horn cells and anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord are not functioning in coordination and getting in each others way. In RSD, the anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord are contributing to the secretion of alpha adinergic chemicals causing vasoconstriction, muscle spasm, and movement disorder. The movement disorder may be in the form of weakness in the extremity, muscle spasm, flexor spasm, tremor, dystonia, clumsiness, flexion of the elbow and knee with resultant inability to move around smoothly, and difficulty with coordination of rapid or repetitive movement of the extremity. The end result is weakness of the extremity.
The long standing disturbance of nerve and muscle function as mentioned above also results in gradual disuse atrophy of the extremity with the RSD being pushed into stage III with atrophy and weakness of the extremity.
3. "Idiopathic paraplegia". If the RSD is not treated aggressively or properly, and specifically if the patient starts using assistive devices such as a cane, brace, crutches, and wheelchair, the RSD weakness deteriorates rapidly resulting in the patient's inability to even stand up. This co-called "idiopathic paralysis" is usually gradual and takes weeks or months to develop.
The exceptions in regard to gradual development of idiopathic paralysis is the so-called "acute idiopathic paralysis" of RSD. This acute, practically sudden onset of paralysis in the lower extremities is the result of two forms of treatments.
A. Insertion of spinal stimulators.
B. Insertion of indwelling catheter over the sympathetic chain of ganglia in the paraspinal region in the lumbar spine region.
The commonest form of "acute idiopathic paralysis" is seen in patients receiving a spinal stimulator. This is seen in around 1/4 of the patients receiving spinal stimulator implantation in the spinal canal. If the stimulator is inserted in the area of inflammation of RSD, then the foreign body effect of the stimulator causes an acute exacerbation and flare-up of the muscle weakness and clumsiness as outlined above with resultant development of paralysis in the lower extremities. If such a phenomenon occurs with the insertion of spinal stimulators in the chronic pain patient, one should realize that the condition is a relatively severe RSD, and the stimulator should be removed immediately.
The second less common form that we are starting to see with more frequency in the past two years, is due to the insertion of the catheters into the epidural space, or the area of chain of sympathetic ganglia to prevent repeated needling of the patient for sympathetic nerve block. This occurrence is far less frequent among the spinal stimulator patients. However, when such a paralysis develops, it is essential to remove the catheter immediately and not to leave it in overnight. In the patients that the catheter is left and is not removed for a few days, the patient even develops incontinence of urine and stool.
Examination of such patients shows a sensory loss around the rectal (perineal) area which is unique in the form of "onion peeling" unilateral sensory loss which is typical of vascular involvement of the spinal cord on one side. This is simply explained on the basis of practically all the other central nervous system acute complications of RSD due to vascular spasm causing disturbance of function.
Unfortunately, such patients are accused of suffering, having "hysterical paralysis" without the examiner bothering to check the sensory function around the perineal region which is diagnostic and demands the removal of the catheter. The sooner the catheter is removed, the less likely the long term side effects.
H. Hooshmand, M.D.
Hmm.... he sure did say a mouthful in number two! Described me to a tee. Well I guess it comes down to everything combined with our nervous systems not funtioning right and the insomnia combined no wonder there is fatigue in the picture. What do you think? Does this make sense to you? What are your thoughts or experiences with fatigue and RSD. I would love to hear them just add them to this post.
Love,
Robyn
<NOBR>First </NOBR> <NOBR>Previous </NOBR> <NOBR>2-9 of 9 </NOBR> <NOBR>Next </NOBR> <NOBR>Last </NOBR> <NOBR>Delete Replies </NOBR>
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 2 of 9 in Discussion
From: Sassy Sent: 4/25/2006 8:47 PM
4-6 hours of sleep a night? wow.. must be nice... I am lucky to get 2 hours..... This week since last Thursday night, I have only gotten a total of 11 hours. Instead of laying in bed awake next to my husband and risk waking him up, I get and go to another room, so I don't ruin his night sleep.
Hope you are feeling better..
Will post more tomorrow..
Toodles,
Sassy
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 3 of 9 in Discussion
From: Sassy Sent: 4/26/2006 7:24 AM
No sleep again last night.... Have to meet with the attorney in about an hour. I need to get dressed. I am scheduled for another block tomorrow. I am so happy when I have those. It means I actually sleep for a day from all of the sedation. Isn't that sad? My mother caused issues over the weekend and I am officially changing my phone number this week so she can only communicate with me via email.. Let's see how she likes that.... The cold hearted witch has tried to drive a wedge between my husband and I and in return it has backfired on her... I guess she should be careful what she wishes for..
By the way, do you have a new member from Fl who hasn't posted yet? Just curious, because my mom said something to me on the phone over the weekend that she only would have known from one of two support groups I joined.... So, I think she is spying.. So like her.......
I will post again by Next Monday.....
I wish everyone Low Low Pain days....... It is supposed to be 93 here today so I can't wait to do my pool exercises...
Toodles,
Sassy
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 4 of 9 in Discussion
From: <NOBR>byrd45</NOBR> Sent: 4/26/2006 10:36 AM
Hi Sassy,
I was the same way as you for the first two years of having RSD. No sleep or maybe an hour or hour and a half a night. That is when they put me on elavil before bedtime so thankful they did! Without it I can't sleep at all. At least with it I stay asleep for the 4-6 hours. Maybe you can ask your doc about something to help you sleep? Just a thought. I know how horrible it feels to be sleep deprived like that. I can't believe your mom is being that mean how horrible! I would change my number too. That is so sad that she can't be supportive instead of cruel. I don't always know where members are from unless they want to share that info, however I will keep my eyes open for you. If she even tried anything funny (posting)I would delete it and her to protect my members including you of course so don't you worry. I'm glad you and your husband realized what she was up to and hopefully everything is okay between you both. Have fun in the pool!
Love,
Robyn
First Previous 2-4 of 4 Next Last Delete Replies
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 2 of 4 in Discussion
From: byrd45 Sent: 5/1/2006 11:21 AM
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 5 of 9 in Discussion
From: Sassy Sent: 4/26/2006 11:32 AM
Thanks Robyn,
I don't want others thinking I am distrusting, because I know there are people who like me, live in Florida and they post, but she specifically stated a couple of things over the phone to me that the only way she would have known then would have been to read them thru one of two support groups I post to. So, I was a bit peeved about it. I do take sleeping pills and they aren't even helping. I slept really good for about an hour last night and asked my husband if I was asleep when he came home from softball to please not wake me... Even if I was on the couch.. Well, he came in the living room and was stroking me hair and then he weent to bed.. I bet it wasn't 15 minutes later, I was wide awake.... I was up the rest of the night.... I wasn't mad at him... He just wanted to love on me.... poor guy....
Anyways, he willl be home all of this evening for me to torment, so I need to think of something extra special to do in his honor.. I have a few ideas...
The pool feels great today.. I am feeling a little sleepy after my exercises so I am going to lay down.. Will post again soon..
Toodles,
Sassy
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 6 of 9 in Discussion
From: <NOBR>EMY2628</NOBR> Sent: 4/27/2006 2:48 AM
Hi Robyn,
I completly understand your description of the exhaustion that comes after having done anything that caused me to push myself in the day or two preceeding the long sleep (if you can call it that). I have been complaing to all my doctors about this in the past few months. I tell them that it is NOT a restfull sleep, and NOT like a "drugged " sleep , but it IS a sleep in which I feel utterly and completely drained of all energy in my entire body. Like you I continously wake up in pain throughout this time (just as I do everynight), I will sllep for maybe an hour and a half to two hours and then wake up in agony and try to reposition myself into some kind of better postion and fall back off into the very restless state, with very strange dreams and this just repeats for hours on end until I somehow find the energy to get up. I've been trying to explain this to my doctors and I am so glad you discussed it, because I was beggining to think I was going crazy or something. I can't do the slightlest thing without feeling like this and when I do something "big", like cook a holiday or family meal, it can litterally take me three or four days to fully recover.
AS I guess you can tell by the time (2:40 AM), tonight is one of those nights when the pain is at such a level that I have to wait until complete exhaustion hits before I can start my restless night (or day which ever the case may be) of sleep, and then I will have one of those horrible days in a day or two because of this also.
I like you am really interested to see if a lot of others experience this too. Now that I know for sure that it is not just me, I know It has to be connected to the RSD, these darn doctors just don't have a clue on what all is inlovled in this (RSD) or how to manage us and our symptoms/side effects or what ever they are!!
I can't believe how horribly my life has turned in a matter of 4 years and I am scared to death of what the future holds for me. Please remember me in your prayers as I will you and all of us who suffer from chronic pain.
Eileen
P.S. Do you also get wild mood swings with this exhaustion pattern? I sure do, maybe that is connected also, who knows!
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 7 of 9 in Discussion
From: <NOBR>tryingtokeepthefaith</NOBR> Sent: 4/27/2006 4:07 PM
Hi everyone,
I can relate to the Fatigue and did and event yesterday and now I ahve so much pain and I'm so tired. The doctor's say keep moving but you do, it take 1-2 days to recover. And the pain is unbelievable, I cooked yesterday for and event at church and now PAIN, FATIGUE, IT'S GOING TO TAKE ME THE REST OF THE WEEK TO RECOVER. I took meds last night, no help. I was so out of it my daughter had to help me. I went to sleep with my glass on, I could not find them this morning my daughter looked for them. She look at me with a sad expression and tears started falling from her my hands were so swollen and I was in so much pain. She said we need to take pictures. Didn't have one but I will get one. I can't type any more still in alot of pain and hands still swollen will talk more later. But understand what you are saying.
Maybel
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 8 of 9 in Discussion
From: theMatrix777 Sent: 4/28/2006 12:21 AM
Perfect subject this week. For my insomnia my dr wanted me checked for sleep
apnea. But for the last 3 days all I can do is the kind of drugged, bad
dream sleep where I can' seem to fully wake up from.
Paragraph 2 might explain why I fall down even though my RSD is in my
hand/arm.
And I am tired all the time. I can hardly stand long enough to shpwer; it
wears me out. It's getting harder to type but I read everything and keep all
of you in my prayers.
Thanks for the article. Hope everyones pains have been low,
Trudy
Recommend Delete Message 1 of 4 in Discussion
From: byrd45 (Original Message) Sent: 5/1/2006 11:19 AM
From: <NOBR>byrd45</NOBR> (Original Message) Sent: 4/25/2006 6:59 PM
Hi Everyone,
This week I thought we could discuss the overwhelming fatigue that RSD brings into alot of our lives. I have been wondering for awhile why do I always feel so tired? Is it the lack of sleep or is it more involved than that? I thought we could benenfit from finding out a little bit more about this. Today was one of those days. All I could do is sleep and sleep and sleep. It is a horrible feeling not a restful sleep but one filled with odd dreams and pain bleeding through. Waking up feeling pain only to fall under yet again. It feels like you are being drugged or something I hate this more than all the insomnia. I have found this usually happens after a particularly stressful day. Has this happened to you as well? Anyway most weeks I have at least one and occasionally two nights where I cannot sleep at all. The other nights I average about 4-6 hours. This is why I have been blaming my fatigue on the insomnia, but I wonder if this isn't the entire answer. Anyhow, I found this info on the subject on Dr. Hooshmand's site:
RSD PUZZLE #16
FATIGUE, WEAKNESS, AND "IDIOPATHIC PARALYSIS"
1. Chronic fatigue is a common symptom of RSD only preceded by pain, depression, insomnia, and muscle spasms or cramps. The chronic fatigue syndrome is a common neurologic condition which is caused by a large list of chronic neurologic illnesses such as multiple sclerosis, chronic pain, systemic immune diseases, head injuries, and any other systemic or brain dysfunction that gets in the way of the normal daily cerebral activity and productivity.
2. Weakness is actually an independent symptom of RSD that may or may not be accompanied by chronic fatigue. The weakness in the muscles of RSD patients is not simply because of fatigue, but it is due to the fact that the anterior horn cells and anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord are not functioning in coordination and getting in each others way. In RSD, the anterior lateral horn cells of the spinal cord are contributing to the secretion of alpha adinergic chemicals causing vasoconstriction, muscle spasm, and movement disorder. The movement disorder may be in the form of weakness in the extremity, muscle spasm, flexor spasm, tremor, dystonia, clumsiness, flexion of the elbow and knee with resultant inability to move around smoothly, and difficulty with coordination of rapid or repetitive movement of the extremity. The end result is weakness of the extremity.
The long standing disturbance of nerve and muscle function as mentioned above also results in gradual disuse atrophy of the extremity with the RSD being pushed into stage III with atrophy and weakness of the extremity.
3. "Idiopathic paraplegia". If the RSD is not treated aggressively or properly, and specifically if the patient starts using assistive devices such as a cane, brace, crutches, and wheelchair, the RSD weakness deteriorates rapidly resulting in the patient's inability to even stand up. This co-called "idiopathic paralysis" is usually gradual and takes weeks or months to develop.
The exceptions in regard to gradual development of idiopathic paralysis is the so-called "acute idiopathic paralysis" of RSD. This acute, practically sudden onset of paralysis in the lower extremities is the result of two forms of treatments.
A. Insertion of spinal stimulators.
B. Insertion of indwelling catheter over the sympathetic chain of ganglia in the paraspinal region in the lumbar spine region.
The commonest form of "acute idiopathic paralysis" is seen in patients receiving a spinal stimulator. This is seen in around 1/4 of the patients receiving spinal stimulator implantation in the spinal canal. If the stimulator is inserted in the area of inflammation of RSD, then the foreign body effect of the stimulator causes an acute exacerbation and flare-up of the muscle weakness and clumsiness as outlined above with resultant development of paralysis in the lower extremities. If such a phenomenon occurs with the insertion of spinal stimulators in the chronic pain patient, one should realize that the condition is a relatively severe RSD, and the stimulator should be removed immediately.
The second less common form that we are starting to see with more frequency in the past two years, is due to the insertion of the catheters into the epidural space, or the area of chain of sympathetic ganglia to prevent repeated needling of the patient for sympathetic nerve block. This occurrence is far less frequent among the spinal stimulator patients. However, when such a paralysis develops, it is essential to remove the catheter immediately and not to leave it in overnight. In the patients that the catheter is left and is not removed for a few days, the patient even develops incontinence of urine and stool.
Examination of such patients shows a sensory loss around the rectal (perineal) area which is unique in the form of "onion peeling" unilateral sensory loss which is typical of vascular involvement of the spinal cord on one side. This is simply explained on the basis of practically all the other central nervous system acute complications of RSD due to vascular spasm causing disturbance of function.
Unfortunately, such patients are accused of suffering, having "hysterical paralysis" without the examiner bothering to check the sensory function around the perineal region which is diagnostic and demands the removal of the catheter. The sooner the catheter is removed, the less likely the long term side effects.
H. Hooshmand, M.D.
Hmm.... he sure did say a mouthful in number two! Described me to a tee. Well I guess it comes down to everything combined with our nervous systems not funtioning right and the insomnia combined no wonder there is fatigue in the picture. What do you think? Does this make sense to you? What are your thoughts or experiences with fatigue and RSD. I would love to hear them just add them to this post.
Love,
Robyn
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From: Sassy Sent: 4/25/2006 8:47 PM
4-6 hours of sleep a night? wow.. must be nice... I am lucky to get 2 hours..... This week since last Thursday night, I have only gotten a total of 11 hours. Instead of laying in bed awake next to my husband and risk waking him up, I get and go to another room, so I don't ruin his night sleep.
Hope you are feeling better..
Will post more tomorrow..
Toodles,
Sassy
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Recommend Delete Message 3 of 9 in Discussion
From: Sassy Sent: 4/26/2006 7:24 AM
No sleep again last night.... Have to meet with the attorney in about an hour. I need to get dressed. I am scheduled for another block tomorrow. I am so happy when I have those. It means I actually sleep for a day from all of the sedation. Isn't that sad? My mother caused issues over the weekend and I am officially changing my phone number this week so she can only communicate with me via email.. Let's see how she likes that.... The cold hearted witch has tried to drive a wedge between my husband and I and in return it has backfired on her... I guess she should be careful what she wishes for..
By the way, do you have a new member from Fl who hasn't posted yet? Just curious, because my mom said something to me on the phone over the weekend that she only would have known from one of two support groups I joined.... So, I think she is spying.. So like her.......
I will post again by Next Monday.....
I wish everyone Low Low Pain days....... It is supposed to be 93 here today so I can't wait to do my pool exercises...
Toodles,
Sassy
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Recommend Delete Message 4 of 9 in Discussion
From: <NOBR>byrd45</NOBR> Sent: 4/26/2006 10:36 AM
Hi Sassy,
I was the same way as you for the first two years of having RSD. No sleep or maybe an hour or hour and a half a night. That is when they put me on elavil before bedtime so thankful they did! Without it I can't sleep at all. At least with it I stay asleep for the 4-6 hours. Maybe you can ask your doc about something to help you sleep? Just a thought. I know how horrible it feels to be sleep deprived like that. I can't believe your mom is being that mean how horrible! I would change my number too. That is so sad that she can't be supportive instead of cruel. I don't always know where members are from unless they want to share that info, however I will keep my eyes open for you. If she even tried anything funny (posting)I would delete it and her to protect my members including you of course so don't you worry. I'm glad you and your husband realized what she was up to and hopefully everything is okay between you both. Have fun in the pool!
Love,
Robyn
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From: byrd45 Sent: 5/1/2006 11:21 AM
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From: Sassy Sent: 4/26/2006 11:32 AM
Thanks Robyn,
I don't want others thinking I am distrusting, because I know there are people who like me, live in Florida and they post, but she specifically stated a couple of things over the phone to me that the only way she would have known then would have been to read them thru one of two support groups I post to. So, I was a bit peeved about it. I do take sleeping pills and they aren't even helping. I slept really good for about an hour last night and asked my husband if I was asleep when he came home from softball to please not wake me... Even if I was on the couch.. Well, he came in the living room and was stroking me hair and then he weent to bed.. I bet it wasn't 15 minutes later, I was wide awake.... I was up the rest of the night.... I wasn't mad at him... He just wanted to love on me.... poor guy....
Anyways, he willl be home all of this evening for me to torment, so I need to think of something extra special to do in his honor.. I have a few ideas...
The pool feels great today.. I am feeling a little sleepy after my exercises so I am going to lay down.. Will post again soon..
Toodles,
Sassy
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Recommend Delete Message 6 of 9 in Discussion
From: <NOBR>EMY2628</NOBR> Sent: 4/27/2006 2:48 AM
Hi Robyn,
I completly understand your description of the exhaustion that comes after having done anything that caused me to push myself in the day or two preceeding the long sleep (if you can call it that). I have been complaing to all my doctors about this in the past few months. I tell them that it is NOT a restfull sleep, and NOT like a "drugged " sleep , but it IS a sleep in which I feel utterly and completely drained of all energy in my entire body. Like you I continously wake up in pain throughout this time (just as I do everynight), I will sllep for maybe an hour and a half to two hours and then wake up in agony and try to reposition myself into some kind of better postion and fall back off into the very restless state, with very strange dreams and this just repeats for hours on end until I somehow find the energy to get up. I've been trying to explain this to my doctors and I am so glad you discussed it, because I was beggining to think I was going crazy or something. I can't do the slightlest thing without feeling like this and when I do something "big", like cook a holiday or family meal, it can litterally take me three or four days to fully recover.
AS I guess you can tell by the time (2:40 AM), tonight is one of those nights when the pain is at such a level that I have to wait until complete exhaustion hits before I can start my restless night (or day which ever the case may be) of sleep, and then I will have one of those horrible days in a day or two because of this also.
I like you am really interested to see if a lot of others experience this too. Now that I know for sure that it is not just me, I know It has to be connected to the RSD, these darn doctors just don't have a clue on what all is inlovled in this (RSD) or how to manage us and our symptoms/side effects or what ever they are!!
I can't believe how horribly my life has turned in a matter of 4 years and I am scared to death of what the future holds for me. Please remember me in your prayers as I will you and all of us who suffer from chronic pain.
Eileen
P.S. Do you also get wild mood swings with this exhaustion pattern? I sure do, maybe that is connected also, who knows!
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Recommend Delete Message 7 of 9 in Discussion
From: <NOBR>tryingtokeepthefaith</NOBR> Sent: 4/27/2006 4:07 PM
Hi everyone,
I can relate to the Fatigue and did and event yesterday and now I ahve so much pain and I'm so tired. The doctor's say keep moving but you do, it take 1-2 days to recover. And the pain is unbelievable, I cooked yesterday for and event at church and now PAIN, FATIGUE, IT'S GOING TO TAKE ME THE REST OF THE WEEK TO RECOVER. I took meds last night, no help. I was so out of it my daughter had to help me. I went to sleep with my glass on, I could not find them this morning my daughter looked for them. She look at me with a sad expression and tears started falling from her my hands were so swollen and I was in so much pain. She said we need to take pictures. Didn't have one but I will get one. I can't type any more still in alot of pain and hands still swollen will talk more later. But understand what you are saying.
Maybel
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Recommend Delete Message 8 of 9 in Discussion
From: theMatrix777 Sent: 4/28/2006 12:21 AM
Perfect subject this week. For my insomnia my dr wanted me checked for sleep
apnea. But for the last 3 days all I can do is the kind of drugged, bad
dream sleep where I can' seem to fully wake up from.
Paragraph 2 might explain why I fall down even though my RSD is in my
hand/arm.
And I am tired all the time. I can hardly stand long enough to shpwer; it
wears me out. It's getting harder to type but I read everything and keep all
of you in my prayers.
Thanks for the article. Hope everyones pains have been low,
Trudy
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